Tire Wear

[BlueHvn]

I've noticed something a little unexpected with my Dunlops on the car. We replaced the back tires just before the dragon last fall at 30,000 miles. The fronts still looked OK and that is to be expected - the fronts don't wear as fast as the backs. It's time to replace the backs again (already) at 41,500 miles and the fronts don't look much different than they did at 30!

Isn't it unusual to get more than two sets of backs to a set of fronts?

(normal wear and tear - not that much drifting and peeling out):D

[modifry]

Yeah, that's actually pretty normal so don't sweat it. I do mostly highway mileage so my ratios are more like 3 to 2 than 2 to 1.

[WebGod]

I'm averaging 35,000 miles for my fronts and around 9-10,000 for my rears...

[NAC]

That sounds about right. The first set of rear S02's I bought for mine lasted about 10k before hydroplaning on wet asphalt. Part of the sacrifice for our cars! I budget $400/year for tires regardless of how fast I go through them. Fronts last about 25-30k though.

[DosEquis Driver]

Fronts last about 25-30k though.

Assuming the camber is set correctly...

The gent who owned the S before Debbie (AP2 w/RE 050 Potenza) had too much negative camber on the fronts and the inboard tread was nearly gone at 15k miles... which coincided with her rears also being worn down to the tread wear indicators.

[S2k Dude]

Assuming the camber is set correctly...

The gent who owned the S before Debbie (AP2 w/RE 050 Potenza) had too much negative camber on the fronts and the inboard tread was nearly gone at 15k miles... which coincided with her rears also being worn down to the tread wear indicators.

My alignments has been check and I tend to go through fronts and back in about 15,000 miles or so. Nothing wrong with the camber, I just drive aggressively through corners all the time and do very little highway miles. So I think your wear intervals are based on how you drive and whether you do mostly city or highway miles. Having a track day or two on the tires will also help wear the fronts out faster.

[DosEquis Driver]

My alignments has been check and I tend to go through fronts and back in about 15,000 miles or so. Nothing wrong with the camber, I just drive aggressively through corners all the time and do very little highway miles.

The previous owner put 15k miles on between April '04 and March '05 running the car between Stone Mountain & Gwinnett: lots of stop and go. Outside and center front tread looked like it had 50% left to go... inside was just about bald.

[OyATL]

That sounds normal to me. I go through 2-3 sets of tires for the rears before I have to replace the fronts.

[suzukasue]

I'll chime in. 'Tis normal!

[Showstopper1969]

I go 25k for all four.:thepimp:

[dp]

I wish I can keep the car low and keep the tires for over 10k miles http://www.s2katlanta.com/%7Es2katl/forum/images/smilies/frown.gif

[KatJ]

My Hankooks are starting to look worn in the rears with 10K on them... and I drive like a girl.:p

[Welery]

Your not supposed to buy new tires til the silver sharp things are showing right? http://www.s2katlanta.com/%7Es2katl/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[OyATL]

I wish I can keep the car low and keep the tires for over 10k miles http://www.s2katlanta.com/%7Es2katl/forum/images/smilies/frown.gif
I know man, riding low sucks sometimes. But it sure looks good. http://www.s2katlanta.com/%7Es2katl/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif

[suzukasue]

...and I drive like a girl.:p
HARDLY! You drive like a bat outta hell!

[KatJ]

HARDLY! You drive like a bat outta hell!
Same thing. :D

[silverfoxs2k]

I average 2:1 backs to fronts.

[modifry]

Your not supposed to buy new tires til the silver sharp things are showing right? http://www.s2katlanta.com/%7Es2katl/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gifLike this?

http://www.baustnet.com/s2k/left_front_bad.jpg

[Cyclon36]

No, you still have some time left on those according to the wear bars :D

[WebGod]

Your not supposed to buy new tires til the silver sharp things are showing right? http://www.s2katlanta.com/%7Es2katl/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gifLike this? :D

http://www.protonstudios.com/photosets/2004/miscphotos_2004/800x600/38000mile_so3.jpg

[Welery]

Jesse has the right idea!

[BlueHvn]

by the look of those picts - i've still got another 3 or 4000 miles left...

I'm just surprised my rear tires are already racing slicks while there isn't hardly any difference in the fronts. I was looking forward to replacing all the rubber and adding nice wheels at the same time... along with coilovers... but losing the rears screws up the schedule.

[Grainger49]

I got about 11,000 out of my rear tires, but only about 16,000 from the fronts.

Seems I do more than spin the rears.

[LazE1]

Has anyone tried the Pirelli PZero family of tires. They have an all weather M+S tire, the NERO, it has a 400 UTOG rating. I think the REO50 is a 140 UTOG.

I know it isn't anywhere in the same performance area as the REO50, but tread life and wet weather performance are substaintially improved. I drive about 25K miles a year to/from work. So I am looking for about double the tread life, but retain Hi performance/hi speed rating, but no track time/autocross on these tires.

Anyone have suggestions in this area?

How about going up in tire size on the stock 17" AP2 wheels? Whats the Max that will fit? And wear well?

Cheers!

[Cyclon36]

Has anyone tried the Pirelli PZero family of tires. They have an all weather M+S tire, the NERO, it has a 400 UTOG rating. I think the REO50 is a 140 UTOG.

I know it isn't anywhere in the same performance area as the REO50, but tread life and wet weather performance are substaintially improved. I drive about 25K miles a year to/from work. So I am looking for about double the tread life, but retain Hi performance/hi speed rating, but no track time/autocross on these tires.

Anyone have suggestions in this area?

How about going up in tire size on the stock 17" AP2 wheels? Whats the Max that will fit? And wear well?

Cheers!
400 sounds like it might be a little too hard of a compound to enjoy the car for what it's meant to be. The RE050's can last over 20k or more with highway driving and occasional spirited driving. I changed mine out at 23k and they had gone through two track days, one Dragon, one SESM and atleast 6 or 7 mountain drives.

I'm running 225 in the front now and 255 in the rear. I wouldn't suggest going wider than that. Actually, a better ratio would be 215 and 255. The stock 215 are narrower than most other brands of the same size so getting an other brand of 215 would be wider than the stock tires.

[LazE1]

Did you go with the larger RE50s or another brand?

[Cyclon36]

Did you go with the larger RE50s or another brand?
Another brand. I went with Falken Azenis RT-615's. They grip quite well, but don't have a lot of rain channels so I'm guessing they'll be bad in the rain as they wear down. So far they've been great and haven't worn much. I've had them for 7k miles so far. They make wider RE050's, but they're the run flat version and it doesn't look like they put any more tread on the ground b/c they have larger rain grooves in them. Your only other option in a wider tier is Kumho Ecsta MX's. A lot of members have used those before and have good things to say. Plus they're a lot cheaper than the RE050's (as are the Falkens).

[S2KJD]

but losing the rears screws up the schedule.I was on this time schedule also, like everyone else, and I knew that I would go through 2 sets of rears b/f one front set, so the schedule was very simple to follow and predict and now I have the Volks and happier than ever:D

[S2k Dude]

Make sure you check tire wear all the way across on the fronts, you may think you have lots of tread but will find the insides of the fronts wear much faster due to the amount of negative camber. Generally the rears will wear even while the fronts will wear out on the inside edges first.

[Grainger49]

Make sure you check tire wear all the way across on the fronts, you may think you have lots of tread but will find the insides of the fronts wear much faster due to the amount of negative camber. Generally the rears will wear even while the fronts will wear out on the inside edges first.Amen! Last time I was at Bob's house he pointed out the uneven wear I was getting on my front tires. That prompted another buy.

This is good advice.
:goodjob::goodjob::goodjob:

[S2KJD]

^Dave's the man:goodjob:

[Smilin' Jack]

Does the tire pressure relate to tire wear?

[Grainger49]

Does the tire pressure relate to tire wear?Yes, if the center is worn too much, that's overinflation. If BOTH outer edges show too much wear, that is the result of underinflation. But if only the inner or outer edge is worn, that is how the car is aligned and how the suspension is set up.

For maximum wear, the tires should be swapped from right to left (with directional tires this requires the tires to be unmounted and remounted).

So, the answer is really yes and no.

[BlueHvn]

Same question but for AP1 - what max tire size is good on 18" wheels - 215/245 or larger?

===================================
--ok - just a heads up - forget about the 18" wheels... I just bought 4 S-02s at Discount Tire on HBR and they met (actually beat) the price offered by Tire Rack/Butler for stock sizes - guess I'll keep it in 16 inch shoes for now.


btw - the guy at Discount said he knew a guy with 18" with something like 235/265 on his S. He had a time figuring out the offsets and had to roll the fenders - but said it looked great.

[BlueHvn]

--ok - just a heads up - forget about the 18" wheels... I just bought 4 S-03s at Discount Tire on HBR and they met (actually beat) the price offered by Tire Rack/Butler for stock sizes - guess I'll keep it in 16 inch shoes for now.
Bump for tire prices:goodjob:

[S2k Dude]

So how much did you pay for the S02's at Discount Tire?

[Grainger49]

Same question but for AP1 - what max tire size is good on 18" wheels - 215/245 or larger?Check here for the start to answering this question:

http://www.s2katlanta.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3186

[BlueHvn]

So how much did you pay for the S02's at Discount Tire?


Actually I went with S-03s instead. Like I said -I checked the Butler price online with buying from Tire Rack and Discount quoted me a mounted price that was lower than what I got from Butler.

I'll have to get the receipt from home to get the exact price - which I'll do tonight. But after looking at the Tire Rack chart - I decided on the S-03s

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a52/jBear2000/TireRack.jpg

[S2KJD]

The treadwears are even close b/w the 2 but all else is a no-brainer to go with the s-03's instead:goodjob:

[S2k Dude]

Many S2000 owner who have put S03's on the car (in the OEM size) didn't like them. Said they car felt squirrely. I believe the S03 sidewall is not as stiff as the S02. I think the only benefit of the S03 is a little better wet weather traction. Bridgestone was offering a 30 day/3000 mile guarantee and I know of a couple S2000 owners who took advantage of that and had the tire dealer change out the S03's for something else. Also, many S2000 owners have complained about how loud the tires get as they wear down. I've also heard the same thing from RSX owners that installed the S03's. Finally, tire wear on the S03 doesn't seem to be any better.

However, owners like Webgod, who have 18" wheels seem to like the way they perform. Most llikely the larger size has a different construction.

If I were spending $800 on a set of tires, given the choice I'd stick with the OEM S02's. No other street tire allows the S2000 to grip as well in the dry.

Just what I've heard, hope your happy with your choice. Was the tire rack recommendation the only research you did before deciding on your purchase?

[BlueHvn]

However, owners like Webgod, who have 18" wheels seem to like the way they perform. Most llikely the larger size has a different construction.

If I were spending $800 on a set of tires, given the choice I'd stick with the OEM S02's. No other street tire allows the S2000 to grip as well in the dry.

Just what I've heard, hope your happy with your choice. Was the tire rack recommendation the only research you did before deciding on your purchase?

it is possible that there may be some slight differences in construction to accomodate size issues - but if they go too far out of spec - they essentially have a different tire and would market it as such.

I originally talked to Discount tire about S-02s and even told them to order a set. Then I looked around and saw the S-03 and liked what I saw - mostly a better overall rating. I decided on taking a chance with S-03s after having read quite a bit of user feedback on different tires both here on this board over the last couple of months as well as over on S2KI. I have friends with Porches and BMWs that also had good opinions on tires and their personal experiences. I also spent a great deal of time looking at numbers and ratings on the web. I had a $1000.00 limit on tire cost so I wouldn't feel saddled with Hankooks or Kumhos (which are good tires - but not what i was looking for.)

I realize that since I didn't ask you - i may have made a terrible mistake that I will regret for the rest of my life - but for now - the tires out perform the Dunlop 8000s I had on the S for almost 15,000 miles. The S-03s grip the road much better than the Dunlops - even when the dunnys were new. I like the way they feel - and the assurance of acutual response is impressive. While I have no experience driving on S-02s in an S - I had driven a Boxster with them and they are indeed good tires. - I know I wasn't impressed with the way the Boxster drove - but i didn't blame the tires entirely for the experience.

Which brings us to a final point. Experience. I came from the generation that made the constant point that experience is everything and if you didn't have real hands on experience - you don't know squat.

That is a fallacy - always has been - and always will be. I've grown up past the hippie dippie goof heads that brought that line of "thinking" - and i hope that the seemingly constant poking you are making and applying the argument from experience - will end once you read this.

This is twice within a weeks time and I frankly don't have the time or inclination to humor you with your barbs. Between nitrogen filled tires and whether my choice to buy one tire over another - is a preference issue. Like I said - I like chocolate - maybe you like vanilla. I certainly don't have an axe to grind with you or anyone else on this board - but i don't back down - and I don't care if you disagree. I'm not trying to cause a stink here either.

If a member can't voice an opinion, or buy something that doesn't follow what the "leader" says do - then there is no place for any independant thinking individual in this "club".

If group think is your thing - go for it.

As for me - I'll find my own open road and just enjoy the hell out of it.

[word]

S03's are less squirmish in 17/18"+ because there's less sidewall to allow flex, not because they add more material on the sidewall to make them stiffer. I'm sure some more air would get rid of the squirmishness.

I've rode with s2000s with S03s at the track, it did feel very responsive during transitions although I wasn't driving. The owners loved them also.

Anything bigger than 16"s Falken RT-615 is best choice of tyres, better than S02 and RE050.

[S2k Dude]

No doubt that S03's will grip better than Dunlops. It all depends on what you want to get out of the car. Looks like people that gave below average reviews of the S02's weren't happy with the wet weather performance after the tires wore down.

Like I said, if you want the best grip available from a street tire, the best choice in the OEM size is the S02. If you want better wet weather performance once the tire wears down then the S03 is the better choice.

I'm not knocking your choice, rather I'm just adding additional information, passing on my knowledge and experience for anyone that's reading the forum so they can also make an informed decision.

[BlueHvn]

Considering all of us who drive our Ss as daily drivers - the need for "track" tires on our cars is considerably less than good all around wet/dry tires. If money is an issue - it doesn't make sense to buy tires that perform best on curves or at the track as a daily tire.
Since this club only does mountain drives about once a month - buying anything but a good high performance all around tire - is a waste of money.
If we all lived in Blairsville and commuted to Atlanta everyday - there may be a point to be made. But we don't... I'd wager to say most of us go in straight lines most of the day with only gentle sweeps and lane changes on occasion.

I also have a wife who drives the S - nearly as much as I do. The last thing she needs or wants is another "Dunlop drifter" as tires. She will never drift through a curve - at least on purpose - and she gives me hell when I do while she's in the car.

So common sense has to play a part in a married man's life - else his life looses immeasurable value.

[S2k Dude]

I drive my car daily and would rather slow down a bit while it's raining and have the awesome dry grip of a summer tire. I bought an S2000 to enjoy the great handling of a purpose built sports car, whether it be in the mountains, at an AutoX, at the track, and to a much lesser degree, on the street. So I chose the best all around tire for those situations. I don't think any tire is a waste of money if the owner is happy with his or her purchase.

Since money is a factor in almost every purchase that I make, I did lots of research online and personally talked to many owners to find out what other max performance tire choices are available. I found that the Kumho MX and the Hankook RS2 are both very good choices. The Kumho's are $25%-30% cheaper than the Bridgestones while the Hankook's are about 50% cheaper. After about 8 months and 10k miles I think I made a wise decision when I purchased the RS2's.